First topic message reminder :

Can I invite the members of the forum to have a debate and post their views on the Scottish Independence issues

There are many topic's involved in a debate of this nature
Example's, Would Scotland have to join the EU if they went Independent
Which currency would they use
Would there be a border between the two countries
Would passport have to be shown when entering or leaving the country
Does it mean that there's no longer a British passport, in my case would it be English and in my wife's case be Scottish
What would happen to the people who live and work near to where the border might be
An English and Scottish married couple have children, which nationality would the children have

On a personal note, my wife is a Scottish lassie, if Scotland get's Independence does that mean that I am married to a foreigner

There are a few to go on with
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] ... s-16779891 Could this be another storm in a "
Tea"
Cup

willowsend wrote:

The only place we found a comment in favour was at a small town called Crieff where we went in a small cafe for a coffee and sandwich.

I visited Crieff in the 80's and stayed at 'The Hydro' Hotel, it stood in many acres of land and the hotel was superb, many Scots went there to stay for weekends and holidays. Whilst there, one evening my daughters let it slip that "
Dad had brought his bagpipes with him."
Ten minutes later I was tuning them up at the end of a corridor and walked into the ballroom where they were holding Scottish country dancing. The bandmaster asked what I was going to play and I replied a melody of Scottish tunes, he said carry on and the band will accompany you and they did play every tune, including Scotland The Brave, to which all the Scots went mad and stamped their feet and thumped their hands on the tables in time with the tune. A wonderful holiday for us and a great country and people.

itchyfeet wrote:

willowsend wrote:

The only place we found a comment in favour was at a small town called Crieff where we went in a small cafe for a coffee and sandwich.

I visited Crieff in the 80's and stayed at 'The Hydro' Hotel, it stood in many acres of land and the hotel was superb, many Scots went there to stay for weekends and holidays. Whilst there, one evening my daughters let it slip that "
Dad had brought his bagpipes with him."
Ten minutes later I was tuning them up at the end of a corridor and walked into the ballroom where they were holding Scottish country dancing. The bandmaster asked what I was going to play and I replied a melody of Scottish tunes, he said carry on and the band will accompany you and they did play every tune, including Scotland The Brave, to which all the Scots went mad and stamped their feet and thumped their hands on the tables in time with the tune. A wonderful holiday for us and a great country and people.

I know the Crieff Hydro well, it appears to have gone down hill a bit over the last few years, only ever used it for morning coffee having been to the cash point first

Salmond and Sturgeon are like the Krankies but without the intellectual rigour. The quality of their 'selling' of independence is laughable. Their assumptions are an act of fiction - continuing use of sterling, continuing membership of the EEC without any re negotiation, continuing employment from UK employers, continuing benefits of UK Government contracts etc etc. They just don't care about the Scottish people - they are so embittered and carry so many chips on their shoulders they'll do anything to get their 5 minutes of fame. I'm sure Scotland could have made a decent fist of independence, however not for a long time under these naïve and barmy SNP plans, the assumptions made by the SNP in favour of independence at the cost to others - like the UK allowing Scotland to remain in the pound, or the EU allowing them to remain as members without a hint of renegotiation - are the sort of things which will scare the money men silly and have them running for the border.

Alex Salmond wants it all ways, he wants to be Prime Minister of an independent Scotland, but at the same time he expects England to keep picking up the tab, and on his terms, he is like a teenager who leaves home but comes back every night to be fed, have his clothes washed and "
borrow"
money from daddy. He should be told in no uncertain terms, if Scotland leaves the union they`re on their own, and he can take RBS with him !!!!.

The real problem is the Conservative party and the SE of England. They mock, deride and slander the Scots. The same happened when the Empire was dissolving;
India would never be able to govern itself nor any of the African nations. Yet here we are 60 years later still being superior and pompous about Scotland.

The latest News
Legal bid to win expat Scots the 'human right' to vote in independence referendum that would scupper Yes vote
[size=150:1la4e2u9]First Minister Alex Salmond has denied expatriates the right to vote

Top barrister Aidan O'Neill claims they have a right to freedom of movement

Denying their vote is illegal and there should be a judicial review
Legal documents are being sent to Salmond and David Cameron
750,000 Scottish expatriates live in England
A judicial review could delay referendum until after September 18

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I follow both sides of the YES/NO debate, both the positive and negative. I understand both points of view, some people pursuing an ideology, and others looking at hard facts and evidence, both positive and negative to back up their point of view. I can see people generally want the same things, but often vehemently disagreeing with each others preferred ideology for achieving them. I personally generally agree in the principle of us all being stronger and more prosperous as a collective than standing alone, which seems to be the positive thrust of the reasons for voting no. However, you have to consider what that means in practice by recognising what has actually happened and is happening now in reality. The current UK union has a government located in Westminster, and all the evidence clearly seems to show that in terms in managing the distribution of wealth, economic opportunities, infrastructure and services, it has clearly served the area of the UK most immediate to where its located, very, very well, largely it seems at great expense of all other areas left neglected. I'm no nationalist, but I'll be voting YES simply for a new fairer system and hopefully instigate a wider change for a healthier collective arrangement.

Firstly, for full democratic representation for the citizens located in the large area I live, to have full political power dedicated 100% to addressing the different priorities in that area, by a full parliament located there. Currently the Scottish representation in Westminster is routinely trumped 10 to 1 on decisions which tend to favour the majority in the S.E. at the expense of Scotland and causing unforeseen consequences. It seems impossible to have a successful one policy fits all approach.

Secondly, I recognise the threat of Westminster seeking to pull itself out of the EU, contradicting their own better together ideological argument for Scotland to stay with the UK. It seems from polls that Scottish citizens by contrast to UK are more international and inclusive in their outlook, and I have no doubt would seek government policies seeking a better, possibly larger collective with which to associate.

Thirdly, thanks to whistle-blowers, investigative journalists, hackers and the internet, I've more recently become aware of many uncomfortable revelations of Westminster's secret activities that seem to directly conflict with citizens interests, coupled with their more and more obvious control and manipulation of the media narrative, they have succeeded in causing me to no longer trust the Westminster system. Logically, my only option is to vote YES, in the hope that it will cause not only Scotland to have a fairer, more transparent system, but also force the UK to re-evaluate how they are being governed, for hopefully a better system to emerge for UK. A collective can only thrive when the people in the collective trust each other, or at the very least have the power to protect themselves from breaches of trust.

The former secretary general of Nato has said that Scottish independence would be cataclysmic for the West in an era of international turmoil.
Speaking in the US, Lord Robertson said a "
debilitating divorce"
after a "
Yes"
vote in September would threaten the stability of the wider world.
He said he believed the American administration was worried about the possibility of Scottish independence.
The Scottish government said the comments were "
crass and offensive"
.
Scotland's Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said she was "
shocked"
by the language of the former Labour defence secretary.
Continue reading the main story
“Start Quote
For the second military power in the west to shatter this year would be cataclysmic in geo-political terms”
End Quote Lord Robertson Former secretary general of Nato
Lord Roberston was speaking at the Brookings Institution where he said the US should make its views public - as should all British allies.
In a strongly-worded speech, he said: "
The loudest cheers for the break-up of Britain would be from our adversaries and from our enemies.
"
For the second military power in the west to shatter this year would be cataclysmic in geo-political terms."

He went on to urge "
Britain's allies"
to speak out and to say that an independent Scotland would "
affect them as well"
.
Lord Robertson added: "
This is not a purely domestic matter even though it's a decision that will be taken by the Scottish people.

"
The Scottish people need to be conscious that they are taking a decision, not just for themselves and for future generations in a one-off vote, but that it also has an effect elsewhere and people who are affected, or think they will be affected, have every right to speak out."

In response to the comments, Ms Sturgeon said that given Lord Robertson's "
long-standing"
opposition to independence, she was not surprised.
However, she added: "
On another level though I am quite shocked at these comments.
'Deeply insulting'
She went on: "
The contribution George Robertson made last night, and particularly the language he has used to make it in, I think does a real disservice to the debate.
"
I am not shouting down George Robertson, I am saying very clearly that I find his comments deeply insulting.
"
He is of course the man that predicted that devolution would kill the SNP stone dead, so his predictions perhaps don't hold too much water."

Ms Sturgeon said she wanted to have a rational debate.
In a plea to the former politician, she said: "
I'm not the person using language like cataclysmic and suggesting that independence would aid the forces of darkness.
"
I would invite George Robertson to come back into the realms of decent and rational debate, because that is the kind of debate we should be having."

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Seems to me that Alex Salmond and his cronies want to keep the pound, the Queen and CBeebies and now NATO on their terms, is he having a laugh [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

scott wrote:

Seems to me that Alex Salmond and his cronies want to keep the pound, the Queen and CBeebies and now NATO on their terms, is he having a laugh [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

First Minister Alex Salmond was on TV this afternoon spouting about the Independence he will achieve for Scotland in September
You can hear/see his speech here [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] ... s-26997887 So what do members think of his
comments and the content of that speech in general

As the outcome won't effect me one iota, all i will say, that for those who are eligible to vote "
vote with your head not with your heart"
! With a NO vote you could try again in the future, with a YES vote your stuck with it!

This information has come from Scotland's leading newspaper The Sunday Post
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Is our poll at the top of the page a fair indication as to what we think will be the outcome ?????
:Ch:Have a Scotch Whisky on me

Ex-pats may be able to vote on independence
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Can it get anymore barmy Voting where you don't live is ridiculous and that's putting it mildly its about time things like this was stopped and bought to an end .

Only 3 weeks to go. Will it be a YES vote or a NO vote. Will the :Sunny:be shining on Scotland or will they be knocking their heads against a Let's all be :: on this little island called The United Kingdom